cake bomb is unfair

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TranceFox
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I'll say this from my own experience in the game

Cake is hardly "easy win". Hedgewars is a very cutthroat game. Killing > Damaging; you're gonna want to kill rather than hurt. Cake's not much of a killing machine at all.

From a standpoint of sheer damage, it's still not the best. Nicely played Dynamite does more, Ball Gun in a good situation does significantly more damage, RC Plane can do a great deal of damage as well (well in the 100s), and Cluster Grenade with the top blocked off can reach over that too I believe. There's probably lots of other stuff that I didn't count that can do way more damage (ex. Watermelon Grenade) but I'm either not sure or unfamiliar with the weapon to tell for certain. Correct me if I'm wrong, but a perfectly placed cake does like 75 dmg. And I don't think they can cross water.

To be honest I'd much rather someone use a cake on me than any other weapon. Cause most likely, it means they're not using it to knock one or more of my hedgehogs off the stage

edit: another thing I would like to say is that protecting yourself from threats shouldn't be your primary concern in this game. of course there's situations you reach in which protection becomes your top priority, but I think in any situation you should be plotting how to kill while reducing your losses. I don't know if it's been mentioned, but one good way to protect yourself from cake is to teleport the hog you think it will be used on.

edit 2: As for the cake being trouble in 1v1 situations, there's still far worse demons IMO. 70-75 dmg is still just that. If you have over that amount, you shouldn't be worried

rbaleksandar
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Fabioamd87 allegedly wrote:

please remove

Shocking Annoyed Worst suggestion ever...

1.It's cool
2.It's very original

TranceFox, you are not right here. You can do more then the TNT with a cake because you can place it even under a hedgehog that's standing on a steal bar and throw him in the water. With TNT you always have to have ground beneath it (or someone's head, but since this head is standing on something hard... Smile).

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Fabioamd87
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(error post)

TranceFox
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rbaleksandar allegedly wrote:

Fabioamd87 allegedly wrote:

please remove

Shocking Annoyed Worst suggestion ever...

1.It's cool
2.It's very original

TranceFox, you are not right here. You can do more then the TNT with a cake because you can place it even under a hedgehog that's standing on a steal bar and throw him in the water. With TNT you always have to have ground beneath it (or someone's head, but since this head is standing on something hard... Smile).


Sorry, was going from a standpoint of damage and killing. Didn't really think of it in the context of how simple it is to use. I guess it has to have SOME advantage to it

I've been using Cake more and I don't think it will ever be overpowered. I barely think it's good. It gets its job done though, I can't disagree with that

Seradest
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ähm ok Shocking

make it 5 Hitpoints lower and the range of 9 secounds.

and we test it ....

Fabioamd87
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Seradest allegedly wrote:

ähm ok Shocking

make it 5 Hitpoints lower and the range of 9 secounds.

and we test it ....


just better Smile

impy
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I agree with fabioam on this. I think the cake is a overpowered it should do similar damage to a grenade or something.

alex12
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Removed my offensive comment.

rbaleksandar
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First, TranceFox, quote right Wink Smiley It looks as if I'm FOR removing it Big Grin

impy allegedly wrote:

I agree with fabioam on this. I think the cake is a overpowered it should do similar damage to a grenade or something.

Second, impy, cake is weaker than the red grenade.

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Here is my Unofficial Manual for HW. Hope you like it. Wink Smiley Still working on it. Don't worry. Will get it finished...Sometime in the future. Big Grin

alex12
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rbaleksandar allegedly wrote:
First, TranceFox, quote right

It does it that way automatically.

rbaleksandar allegedly wrote:
Second, impy, cake is weaker than the red grenade.

So true.

DrDickens
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Leave the cake alone! Fabio if you lost because of cake and now owe someone a beer, it's your fault.

БЫСТРО БЛДЖАД! Полицейский, что это необходимо для Вас, блджа, падает отсюда блджад!

Fabioamd87
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there are other people that agree with me,
wasn't me that bumped this thread...

with love,
fabio.

impy
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alex12 allegedly wrote:

Its fine so long as you only get one. Plus, if you don't like it disable it. Aghh Someone lock this topic already. Pouncing

Isn't this suppose to be general discussion? Locking this topic would be dumb.

Meshen
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alex12 allegedly wrote:

Its fine so long as you only get one. Plus, if you don't like it disable it. Aghh Someone lock this topic already. Pouncing

Lock the topic because people have a different opinion to you? There's a good discussion going on here, something that's needed for the game to carry on improving - but thanks for the suggestion anyway Stalin.

Anyway, I agree with the people that said the cake is overpowered. Not in terms of damage but in terms of how far it can travel - it's absurd. I'd say the timer on it needs to be turned down to around 4 or 5 seconds, it'd still be a useful weapon in awkward situations and would remove the option of sending it half way around the map to kill someone because you suck with the weapons that take skill to use.

p00ka
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1) I think the cake is over-powered.
2) The napalm should hiss when it hits the sea if possible Smile
3) The petrol bomb was a fun addition to the thrown weapons, maybe a flamethrower might be fun too.
4) An oil-slick might be fun, reducing friction like a kind of mine - hard to cross.
5) Handcuffs - you attach your hog permanently to another enemy hog so thatneither can move without the other Smile Annoyed Annoyed Annoyed

Meshen
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Good suggestions, wrong place...

sleeper
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cake, i think, should be similar in power to a green grenade and the number of turns it takes to use it should be lowered to balance its loss in power.

however i dont think it its too overpowered, youre given several turns before you can use it anyway and more offen than not, people are in safe places that a cake can never get to.

with the implementation of large maps i really think cake should stay the same and i hope its walk time is extended (for large maps only of course), but on a normal medium map, cake should be less powerful - green grenade strength.

alex12
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Meshen allegedly wrote:
Lock the topic because people have a different opinion to you? There's a good discussion going on here, something that's needed for the game to carry on improving - but thanks for the suggestion anyway Stalin.
Anyway, I agree with the people that said the cake is overpowered. Not in terms of damage but in terms of how far it can travel - it's absurd. I'd say the timer on it needs to be turned down to around 4 or 5 seconds, it'd still be a useful weapon in awkward situations and would remove the option of sending it half way around the map to kill someone because you suck with the weapons that take skill to use.

I guess I should have stated that I was on your side but the topic was getting annoying. The range is to far.

BTW: The Stalin comment was good.

Meshen
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Fair enough. =]

mfosby
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The cake rocks! Smile

but maybe you could make two type of cakes?

The current could be a "super cake" and the standard cake could be triggered by a timer.. SO u need to make a estimate of the length of the path for the cake.

Could maybe be a slowdown/speedup feature the last two seconds, almost like brooming in curling, hehe.

This would make the cake less powerful for the not-so-skillful but still cake'y like we want it to be Wink Smiley

Tim da Man
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really still arguing about the cake??? part of the skill involves integrating the light and heavy weapons throughout the game using each when it will give the most damage. the skill in the cake is not the usage itself, but deciding when to use it based on what weapons are left, the enemies' strength, etc... Wink Smiley

bananaoomarang
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oh come on. Stop arguing about the cake. If you don't want to use it, take it out of your weapon scheme or even compile the game without it. hedgewars is open, recompile it, redistribute it as hedgewars CAKEFREE VERSION. Just stop arguing, it's an integral part of the game, leave it alone.

Pit has finaly returned. FINALY.

Tim da Man
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ooohhh i just though of a good idea: cake will be the same except that you can only stop it by setting a timer for it, that way it would be harder to control and involve more skill Big Grin

Kita
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I actually like the cakebomb but I do think that it feels more like a crazy weapon more than something that can be given to you by default.

RoFra
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The cake is awesome Cake

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